DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. SHAPIRO
MR. SHAPIRO: Good afternoon, Mr. Norris.
MR. NORRIS: Good afternoon.
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MR. SHAPIRO: Were you at the airport on June the 12th, 1994 as a courier?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: And why is that date important to you?
MR. NORRIS: That was the night that we met or saw O.J. Simpson at the airport and learned the next day that his ex-wife had been murdered.
MR. SHAPIRO: When you say "We," were you with someone else at the airport?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: Who were you with?
MR. NORRIS: Mike Gladden.
MR. SHAPIRO: And is he here this afternoon?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: Where were you when you--did you observe a limousine that evening?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: What time did you observe the limousine?
MR. NORRIS: Approximately 11:20 to 11:25.
MR. SHAPIRO: Where were you when you observed the limousine?
MR. NORRIS: Walking to get into our vans. We had just dropped some packages off at the airport.
MR. SHAPIRO: And did you take particular notice of this limousine?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: For any particular reason?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: What was the reason?
MR. NORRIS: It pulled up right next to our vans and kind of blocked us in.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did you see someone open the door to the limousine?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: Who opened the door of the limousine?
MR. NORRIS: The limousine driver.
MR. SHAPIRO: And did you see someone get out of the limousine?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did you recognize that person?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: Who did you recognize that person as?
MR. NORRIS: O.J. Simpson.
MR. SHAPIRO: About what time was it that you saw Mr. Simpson get out of the limousine at the airport?
MR. NORRIS: Between 11:20 and 11:25.
MR. SHAPIRO: Was he carrying anything when he got out of the limousine?
MR. NORRIS: I don't remember him carrying anything when he got out.
MR. SHAPIRO: What did you see him do when he got out of the limousine?
MR. NORRIS: He walked to the--well, as he got out, I said, "Hey, what's up O.J.," and then he walked to the back of the limo.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did he respond at all to you?
MR. NORRIS: Yes, he did.
MR. SHAPIRO: What did he respond?
MR. NORRIS: He said, "Hey, what's happening?"
MR. SHAPIRO: Did he look at you when he said that?
MR. NORRIS: Yes, he did.
MR. SHAPIRO: About how far away from you was he?
MR. NORRIS: I'd say approximately about eight feet.
MR. SHAPIRO: About the distance we are here or a little closer?
MR. NORRIS: About the same distance.
MR. SHAPIRO: And to your knowledge, did your friend say anything to Mr. Simpson?
MR. NORRIS: He asked him could he get an autograph.
MR. SHAPIRO: And did Mr. Simpson reply?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: What did he reply?
MR. NORRIS: "Hold on just a minute while I take care of my luggage."
MR. SHAPIRO: Did he then go somewhere in the direction of the limousine?
MR. NORRIS: Yes. He went towards the back of the limousine.
MR. SHAPIRO: And did you see him do something?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: What did you see him do?
MR. NORRIS: He was in a bag, one of the bags in the back of the limousine. Well, it was on the ground.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did he open the bag?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did he appear to take something out?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: Objection. This is all leading, your Honor.
THE COURT: Sustained.
MR. SHAPIRO: What did you see him do with the bag at the back of the limousine?
MR. NORRIS: He went--was going through the bag and he looked like he pulled out a piece of paper or could have been a ticket or anything like--something like that.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did it appear similar to the size of what--
MS. CLARK: Objection, your Honor. Leading.
THE COURT: Sustained.
MR. SHAPIRO: Are you familiar with what airline tickets look like?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: And compared to what airline tickets look like, did you have any opinion as to whether this was consistent with that?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: And what was your opinion?
MR. NORRIS: That it looked like an airline ticket.
MR. SHAPIRO: What did you see Mr. Simpson do at that point in time?
MR. NORRIS: Umm, he put a bag over his shoulder and had a bag in his hand and he remembered to give Mike an autograph.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did you see him sign the autograph for Mike?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did you have a--can you tell us what--how Mr. Simpson appeared during the period of time that you saw him?
MR. NORRIS: Umm, he just appeared like, you know, nonchalant, just like he was going, you know, getting ready to leave on a flight. I mean--
MR. SHAPIRO: How did he look to you? Could you describe that to the jury?
MR. NORRIS: He looked natural. He was dressed real nice, you know, had on like stone-washed type denim outfit, you know, trying to look kind of young, you know, just--I mean he was just, you know, just trying to be cool, you know.
MR. SHAPIRO: And would you describe his demeanor to the jury?
MR. NORRIS: He just--I mean, he just was like smooth, just, you know, hey, just walking through like, "I'm O.J."
MR. SHAPIRO: Did he appear to be rushed in any way?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did he appear to be distracted in any way?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did he appear to be preoccupied in any way?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did you--you said he was wearing some stone-washed clothes. Is that similar to a denim material?
MR. NORRIS: Yes. Like a blue jean type material.
MR. SHAPIRO: And can you describe the hue of that material?
MR. NORRIS: Excuse me?
MR. SHAPIRO: The darkness or lightness of that material.
MR. NORRIS: It's more of a light color. That's--it's like a stone wash. It's like a lighter denim, lighter blue jean type. It wasn't like a dark like 405 type blue jean. It was, you know, much lighter.
THE COURT: You mean 501.
MR. NORRIS: 501. Right. Sorry.
THE COURT: Just relax, Mr. Norris.
MR. NORRIS: Okay.
MR. SHAPIRO: Now, during the period that you saw O.J. Simpson, did you observe his hands?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did you see any cuts on his hands?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MR. SHAPIRO: See any band aids on his hands?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MR. SHAPIRO: See any bruises on his face?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did he appear to be sweating?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did anything at all appear to be out of the ordinary to you when you saw Mr. Simpson?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MR. SHAPIRO: Was he cordial?
MR. NORRIS: Yes. Very. I mentioned to him that Marcus was out there earlier. I had heard Marcus was there, and he said, "Yes, I know." And I asked him about his son, if he was still at SC, and he said, "No. He's through."
MR. SHAPIRO: So he had enough time for small talk for you?
MR. NORRIS: Right.
MR. SHAPIRO: And you said initially he told your friend he had to take care of his luggage, but then he came back and gave the autograph?
MR. NORRIS: Right. That's correct.
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CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MS. CLARK
MS. CLARK: Good afternoon, Mr. Norris.
MR. NORRIS: How you doing, Miss Clark?
MS. CLARK: Okay. I just have a few questions for you, sir.
MR. NORRIS: Okay.
MS. CLARK: So when you saw the Defendant on the date of June the 12th at the airport, he appeared just like you'd seen him on TV commercials and stuff, right?
MR. NORRIS: Right.
MS. CLARK: Just what you expected?
MR. NORRIS: Right.
MS. CLARK: All right. You didn't see him at 10:00 o'clock, correct?
MR. NORRIS: No, I didn't.
MS. CLARK: And you didn't see him at 10:15?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: Not at 10:30?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: And not at 11:00 o'clock?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: So you don't know what he looked like when he got into the limousine at around 11:00 or 11:10?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: You said that he was wearing stone-washed jeans, light colored denim?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: Do you remember what kind of shirt he was wearing, sir?
MR. NORRIS: It was like a denim-type shirt. I have one similar to it. It's light in color. Like, you know, a blue jean shirt.
MS. CLARK: Right. Was it long sleeved, sir?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: Can you describe for us the--you indicated that--excuse me. Strike that. He went to the back of the limousine, correct?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: And you saw him get a bag out of the back of the trunk of the limousine?
MR. NORRIS: I didn't see him get out.
MS. CLARK: He reached in to it?
MR. NORRIS: No. The bag was already--I believe was already out on the ground.
MS. CLARK: Okay. Can you describe that bag for us, sir?
MR. NORRIS: It was black.
MS. CLARK: Can you show us with your hands how big it was?
MR. NORRIS: I couldn't tell you exactly how big it was.
MS. CLARK: Would the style of the bag be like a duffel bag?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: That sounds right to you?
MR. NORRIS: Uh-huh.
MS. CLARK: And could you remember--I'm sorry. Is that yes?
MR. NORRIS: Yes. I'm sorry.
MS. CLARK: And was it black?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: Okay. And that was on the ground next to the trunk of the limousine, was it?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
*****
MS. CLARK: Okay. When you saw him get out of the limousine, sir, was he carrying any small dark bag like about the size of a book bag or knapsack with him?
MR. NORRIS: I don't recall him carrying anything.
MS. CLARK: Okay. Do you recall seeing a bag like that in his possession when you saw him at the airport on the night of June the 12th, small dark knapsack or book size bag?
MR. NORRIS: Umm, I would say the smallest bag would be like an athletic bag.
MS. CLARK: Like the one you just described to us on the ground next to the trunk of the limousine?
MR. NORRIS: Right.
MS. CLARK: That was the smallest that you saw him with?
MR. NORRIS: That would be the smallest that I would say I saw him with, yes.
MS. CLARK: Okay. So then you did not see him in possession of any smaller dark bag like the size of a book bag or knapsack?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: Okay. And you did not see the Louie Vuitton garment bag?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: So could you describe for us the bags that you did see him with?
MR. NORRIS: There was a golf bag, the bag that he had--that he was--had in the back of the limo, he put over his shoulder and he carried an athletic bag.
MS. CLARK: And the bag that he carried over his shoulder, what kind of bag was that, sir?
MR. NORRIS: It was a black bag.
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MS. CLARK: And then your friend--at the point that your friend asked for his autograph, he had already gotten his bags, correct?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: What had he done?
MR. NORRIS: He was going to the trunk to get his bags, and my friend was standing next--like at the back of the van where he was and asked him could he get that autograph.
MS. CLARK: And he said, "Hold on a second. I've just got to get my bags"?
MR. NORRIS: "Let me take care of my bags." Yeah.
MS. CLARK: And then he did go take care of his bags; is that right?
MR. NORRIS: Correct.
MS. CLARK: And then he picked up that black garment bag and put it over his shoulder?
MR. NORRIS: Well, yeah. A black bag.
MS. CLARK: Okay. A black bag that looked like a garment bag?
MR. NORRIS: Could be. I don't know.
MS. CLARK: Something he carried over his shoulder?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: All right. And then he picked up the other duffle-type bag that was on the ground; is that right?
MR. NORRIS: No. The bag that he was--that he looked like he pulled a ticket, something out of, that's the bag he put over his shoulder.
MS. CLARK: Okay. He put that over his shoulder?
MR. NORRIS: Right.
MS. CLARK: And there was another black bag?
MR. NORRIS: An athletic bag.
MS. CLARK: An athletic bag?
MR. NORRIS: Uh-huh.
MS. CLARK: Okay. And how did he carry that athletic bag?
MR. NORRIS: In his hand.
MS. CLARK: Okay. And then he went to sign--at that point, did he go to sign your friend--give him his autograph?
MR. NORRIS: Well, he got ready to walk away, and then he remembered, he said, "Oh," and he said, "Here," and he gave him his autograph.
MS. CLARK: And what hand did he sign with?
MR. NORRIS: He had the--the paper I believe was in his left hand and the pen with his right hand.
MS. CLARK: So he put down the black bag?
MR. NORRIS: He had a bag--okay. Go ahead.
MS. CLARK: So did he put down both bags that he was carrying in order to do the autograph?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: What did he do?
MR. NORRIS: He kept one bag on his shoulder and he wrote the autograph.
MS. CLARK: And what did he sign--which hand did he sign with?
MR. NORRIS: The right hand.
MS. CLARK: So then he was carrying the other bag over his shoulder with his left; is that right?
MR. NORRIS: No. It was on his right arm. It was a strap, a strap--he had it over on his arm, right, and he signed with his hand.
MS. CLARK: What happened to the other bag?
MR. NORRIS: The other bag he put down.
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MS. CLARK: Were you studying his hands very carefully, sir, to see if there was any injury to them?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: You didn't expect him to be injured that night, did you?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: Now, when he reached down into that black duffle bag, did you see him grunt or grimace in pain as he bent over?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: Did he have any--seem to have any trouble unzipping that bag, sir?
MR. NORRIS: I didn't notice him unzip it.
MS. CLARK: Okay. Did you see him take out the ticket or what appeared to be an airline ticket?
MR. NORRIS: Excuse me?
MS. CLARK: Did you see him take out what appeared to you to be an airline ticket?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: And did you see him straighten up from lifting--taking that out of the duffle bag?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: And did he seem to have any trouble bending over or standing up?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: Now, at the time that you saw Mr. Simpson that night, sir, you did not know that the murders of Nicole Brown and Ronald Goldman had occurred, did you?
MR. NORRIS: No.
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MS. CLARK: You didn't know anything about the case, correct?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: And there was no particular reason that you expected to see any cut or injury on Mr. Simpson, correct?
MR. NORRIS: Correct.
MS. CLARK: And you were not studying his face or his hands or his body to examine them for bruises or cuts because you didn't expect to find that, correct?
MR. NORRIS: Correct.
MS. CLARK: Now, was that the first time you had ever met him, the Defendant, in person?
MR. NORRIS: Umm, I've seen him in person before.
MS. CLARK: And how was that, sir? At the airport?
MR. NORRIS: No. When we were--when I was younger, our family went to Knotts Berry Farm, and his family was at Knotts Berry Farm.
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MS. CLARK: Okay. You didn't speak to him on those occasions?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: And you saw him, he was driving in his car, was he?
MR. NORRIS: Yeah.
MS. CLARK: What kind of car was that?
MR. NORRIS: I don't recall. It's been--it was in like the mid 80's.
MS. CLARK: Okay. And so are those all the contacts you've ever had the times you've seen the Defendant?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: So you only spoke to him on this one occasion on June the 12th, correct?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: So would it be fair to state that you don't know how he usually looks in a social setting with other people, correct?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: And would it be also fair to say that if there was some subtle difference in the way he was acting on the night of June the 12th, you wouldn't know that?
MR. NORRIS: Right.
MS. CLARK: And if the Defendant had been sweating at 10:00 o'clock or 10:15 or 10:30 that night, you wouldn't know about that, would you, sir?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: And if he had been bleeding at 10:00 o'clock, 10:15 or 10:30 that night, you wouldn't know that either, would you, sir?
MR. SHAPIRO: Objection. Irrelevant.
THE COURT: Overruled.
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: Thank you, Mr. Norris.
THE COURT: All right. Mr. Shapiro.
MR. SHAPIRO: Thank you very much, your Honor.
REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. SHAPIRO
MR. SHAPIRO: Mr. Norris, you told us that the first time you saw Mr. Simpson was 11:20; isn't that correct?
MR. NORRIS: Correct.
MR. SHAPIRO: So clearly, anything that happened before that, you would have no way of knowing what took place, would you?
MS. CLARK: Objection. Leading.
THE COURT: Overruled.
MR. NORRIS: No.
MR. SHAPIRO: When you looked at Mr. Simpson, are you sure that you didn't see--well, strike that. Did you see any cuts on his hands at all?
MS. CLARK: Objection. Asked and answered.
THE COURT: Overruled.
MR. NORRIS: No.
MR. SHAPIRO: You described the bag that he was carrying as having a strap?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: And after he gave the autograph to your friend Mike, did you see where he went?
MR. NORRIS: Towards the door of the air--in the airport.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did you ever see him stop at a trash can and throw anything in a trash can?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MR. SHAPIRO: And did you have any conversation with Mike relating to the way Mr. Simpson looked that night?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
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MR. SHAPIRO: How did you describe the way he looked?
MS. CLARK: Objection. Hearsay.
THE COURT: Sustained.
MR. SHAPIRO: Did you describe--did you verbalize the way he appeared?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MR. SHAPIRO: And how did he appear?
MS. CLARK: Objection, your Honor.
THE COURT: Overruled.
MR. NORRIS: He appeared to be--like I mentioned to Mike, appeared to be, you know, trying to dress young.
MS. CLARK: Objection. Objection.
THE COURT: Excuse me. Hold on. Mr. Norris, just tell us, without telling us what you told anybody else--
MR. NORRIS: Okay.
THE COURT: --how did Mr. Simpson appear to you that evening?
MR. NORRIS: He appeared to dress real young, dress real nice and, you know, just--I mean, he was dressed real casual.
MR. SHAPIRO: And his attitude and demeanor was what?
MR. NORRIS: Real nice.
MS. CLARK: Objection. Asked and answered.
MR. SHAPIRO: Thank you. Nothing further, your Honor.
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RECROSS-EXAMINATION BY MS. CLARK
MS. CLARK: After Mr. Simpson gave your friend an autograph, Mr. Simpson walked away; is that correct?
MR. NORRIS: Correct.
MS. CLARK: You stopped observing him at that point, correct?
MR. NORRIS: As he walked to the door.
MS. CLARK: Uh-huh. Did you turn to watch him as he walked to the door?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: Did he appear to limp?
MR. NORRIS: No.
MS. CLARK: Walked okay, didn't he?
MR. NORRIS: Yes.
MS. CLARK: All right. Did you ever see him talk to the skycap at the skycap station there outside the doors?
MR. NORRIS: That's when we left, about the time the skycap was coming back out.
MS. CLARK: Okay. So at the point when he went, got to the skycap, you took off?
MR. NORRIS: When he walked to the door to where he would meet the skycaps at, that's where we left.
MS. CLARK: All right. So you were not present to observe any interaction between him and the skycap or anything that transpired at that point because you left?
MR. NORRIS: Right.
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THE COURT: Yes, he may [be excused]. Mr. Norris, thank you very much, sir.
MR. NORRIS: All right.